Lived Experience Forum

[Owlunar]

@BlueBay and I have written a lot about how our mothers treated us - both of us have had different experiences

And I know there are other people here with similar experiences

So Bay and I have decided to discuss that and because threads do get crowded with off-topic conversation - which is okay - I think it's wise to start a new thread here - because those of us who have had our childhood taken away or otherwise damaged by an abusive mother (or father) we need to find our way out - and the way out is through

My mother was physically abusive - something I don't like talking about - when I was young but when I fought back she became verbally and emotionally abusive - and there was no way of living around her - so I left as soon as I could - into a marriage that was not suitable

Then for years at a time I would not see my family of origin - through the darkest times in my life I kept away - who wants to be around a person who tears the ground away from under them constantly

So for the last 2.5 years of her life I did not see my mother - she was being well cared for so that was not my responsibility - but I refused to tolerate that mouth and that rejection any more

And I don't feel guilty

But to this day it hurts - and so last week when I saw my therapist we talked about this.

Yes - what my mother did was wrong

It cut away my self-esteem - something I have now - maybe always had because I stood up for myself - but I had trouble seeing it

And it will hurt - maybe it will always hurt

But no one wants to have some one else's bad behaviour stealing their time in their adult life - so what do we do

We have to take our power back - and maybe this willl take time - but since I saw my therapist last week I have imagined myself talking to my mother twice - and yes - whether she can hear me or not - I have spoken my piece and I will again

It is hard to reconcile the past when we do not have all the information to balance the so-called books

So it can't be rational - it has to come from somewhere inside us and how hard that is!!!!!!!!!

But we have the right to peace in our lives - so let's talk about it

Dec

[Former-Member]

Hi @Owlunar and All,

I think you opened up this topic so thoughtfully Dec and for those who have been raised by a neglectful or uncaring mother, it is very painful to come to terms with.

I think apart of what makes this so hard is the picture/concept of what a mother should be /do for her children and this notion of unconditional love. I'm not convinced that unconditional love actually exists for humans (dogs yes; humans, well, not really). We carry this picture of a loving, attentive Mum who takes care of us and makes us feel loved and valued. Some people are lucky enough to have a Mum like that. 

Many others are raised by a narcissistic or unavailable mother, and this sets up a dynamic of wanting her love and care so much, but having to accept that it is not there. And that doesn't make one less valuable as a human being but often that's how one feels.

My experience of clients with a narcissistic mother is that their social network don't quite get why they can't reconcile or forgive their mother. However every contact with her can be hurtful and stressful. As adults we get to choose who we have in our lives, and sometimes we have to distance ourselves from relationships that harm us.

Some roads of recovery can be to find a friend/relative who is like a mother figure and can be caring and empathic. Also to learn how to mother ourselves through good self care and compassion. Or changing the pattern by being a conscious and caring mother / father to our own children, pets, children we teach etc.

I'm interested to hear from other members who have had this experience with their mother or father.

kind regards,

Frog

[BlueBay]

Hi @Owlunar

thank you for starting this topic.  Even though this topic is so hard for me to get my head around, I struggle so much with what my mother has done to me over the years.

@Former-Member you wrote "I think apart of what makes this so hard is the picture/concept of what a mother should be /do for her children and this notion of unconditional love. I'm not convinced that unconditional love actually exists for humans (dogs yes; humans, well, not really). We carry this picture of a loving, attentive Mum who takes care of us and makes us feel loved and valued. Some people are lucky enough to have a Mum like that"

This is me.  I carry this picture in my head of my mum, a mum that should be caring, loving, supportive without any judgement at all towards their children.  I carry this belief that mums should be there for their children no matter what happened to them all those years ago.   I am sorry I need to stop, I am so upset, i will come back later to type the rest, if i can.

it's so important for me to get this out but not right now 😞

[Owlunar]

Thanks @TAB@BlueBayand @Former-Member

I get very maternal when I open a thread - and this is the case today - so I am thrilled to get up this morning and find I have three comments already - and they are good ones

I will answer each one seperately

Tab - I was going to include fathers in this thread but through the process of writing either forgot or decided to start a different thread for fathers - but still - here we are and we have your Mr Cranky

[Owlunar]

Hi @BlueBay

I knew that this would be a hard subject for you and yes - you can only deal with it in bitznpiecez - and that is all I want you to do. Add a little bit and come back when you are ready

About unconditional love - that is a hard thing to understand - because sometimes a person who asks for unconditional love is in no state to return it - I had this problem with my ex-boyfriend - he wanted unconditional love from me - and almost had it - but he could not return it - which being a mother I understood - but he did not try to overcome it - and this point stuck in my craw

But we would like it from our mothers and many people get it - lucky them - but this is not about them - it's about us who had condtions place on us - like - never talk about (certain things) - behave - be honest - be obedient and be-have. Tidy up behind yourself, do your homework, practise the piano and BEHAVE.

And sometimes being beaten at the same time - but fighting back did two things - it made my mother try harder and I learned what not to be - I am not like my mother

I think we develop a picture in our mind about what a mother "should" be like because we see it in other children - unfortunatly this is not the case - I can tell you that a perfect mother maybe existed once - and this is the "archetypal" Mother - but in my studies I have found that the image of the perfect mother is so rare - no one could live up to her - she is of course- in Western Societies - The Virgin Mary

There are many different mothers and I have a book called Women who Run with the Wolves - and @utopia has read this too - and I will get to different kinds of mothers in time

I was a mother who dealt in Tough Love - and I was far from perfect - I did a lot of yelling but I was not into ill-treating my children - they needed different things and I loved them differently

But I don't know where I learned to be a better mother than mine - and obviously you are a better mother than yours - so you are not caught in a terrible trap but rather you are suffering from the treatment you had - esp after you were abused by in a bad way by people and your mother told you that you ruined the whole family - totally impossible - no one is that powerful

My mother did not want to be upset - and I often feel it would have been better if she had have been upset now and again -

The idea of this exercise is to find a way to stop all this hurting Blue - and we have to empty ourselves of the hurt to do this - and we need to sort it out -

And all the time we are working on one side of the ledger - so we only have half of the data required - and our half is impaired because we were children and didn't understand what was happening - didn't even know it was wrong - and even so - the data we have from our mothers' side is also corrupt because they didn't have a grasp on what they were doing

And the whole thing is fraught through with misunderstandings, hurt, punishments, withdrawal of love and orders to BEHAVE and SHUT UP and YOU ARE BAD -

All leading to pain

Bay - just write what you can when you can - there is no pressure - my therapist is great - she doesn't put any pressure on - just tells me - and I feel free to ask questions

It will get better - right now you are in pain because the truth about your mother came out when you were in hospital late last year and you did not have a good experience then

But you are working hard now - and you are a good mother - the evidence is your children and in a few months you will be a grandmother

And as a mother and a grandmother you have wonderful experience and know what not to be - as is the case with me - I know what not to be

Hugs and take your time - no need to work at it until you are upset - this is writing to heal - not writing to hurt

Hugs - Dec

[BlueBay]

Hi again @Owlunar

Continue from this morning:

I do hold in my 'vision' a picture of how a mum 'should' be. And my mum is not like my vision at all.  Maybe your're right there is no mum out there like that.

I guess I struggle so much because I was always a people pleaser and to a certain degree still am.  And all my life i was always wanting to please my mum; wanting her approval; wanting her to love or like me and my ideas. And so many times she would scoff at my ideas, or tell me what she thought and i would always go with her idea rather than mine.  Because i didn't want to be 'in the bad books with her'.  This is so hard @Owlunar i struggle so much even just writing this.

I just thought that by me telling her 7 yrs ago that i remembered my childhood abuse that she would love me; support me and even just give me a hug. But i never got it.

And you know how that feels, I know you do - abandoned, rejected, hated, not supported or cared for.

It hurts, it hurts so much to feel this again. it was bad enough when i was a child and now i am going through it again.  

i wanted to share with her so much stuff, stuff at home with the kids; share their journeys, i wanted to share with her my kids 21st birthdays; my 50th and even now my daughter's pregnancy.  i wantec to share all of that - but it will never happen, some of it has already happened and i know the others won't happen.

I feel so jealous and angry at times when i see so many young ladies out there with their mums.  having a good time, shopping, having coffee etc.  I know i do have this with my daughter but i still miss it with my mum.

@Owlunar i am sorry this is so hard, i don't know if i can keep typing.

I know that i will be a better grandma than what my mum was to my kids; but sometimes it scares me that i will turn out exactly like her.  and i can't do that; i am crying @Owlunar.  i will write more later.  I know this is writing not to hurt me; even though i am crying; i guess thhis is healing.

Have my psychologist appt at 2pm so i will come back later on. xxxooo

[0402cliffe]

Hi Frog, this is my first time on here. I have Depression, Anxiety and Bi Polar. My mum is a control freak, very dominating, when I was a child i didn't get a say in anything, I had to do what she wanted when she wanted. My dad has had the same for the psst 60 years and it's really getting to me, now and I have a lot of resentment towards my mum for what she has done to dad he's 86. Dad is mums carer and she just hounds him. He waits on her hand and foot and she just abuses him most of the day he walks around on egg shells waiting for a serve that he doesn't know what for. Since xmas I haven't been able to bring myself to call my mum I have a lot of anger inside and don't know how to over come it.

I've also had problems with relationships, that's for another day.
Hope this isn't too much.

0402cliffe

[Owlunar]

Hi @BlueBay

I read your post - I thought the same about my mother - but I got the bad-mother treatment and kept leaving

I asked my therapist about this and it was the adult way to deal with the situation - and I was abused by some teenagers who were babysitting me when I was 3/4 years old - and I told my mother but was punished - but I don't recall ever going there to be babysat again

Yes - it hurts like crazy - and your mother sounds weird and this I understand - whatever my daughter told me I believed - whatever my son told I was scepitcal about - but then - I never punished him about what he told me either

I was there for him in the end - and I saw my mother in the end too - and I saw her regret - alas - that is all I have except this

By walking away I kept my values - my life - my self-esteem - had I tried to get my mother to love me or to show she loved me I would not have ever received anything from her - and neither would you

So you have taken a similar path and kept away and I know this hurts like so much - it is impossible to describe - but she would never want you the way you are and you cannot be anyone else

But I care about you - I am old enough to be your mother and I have had my heart broken too

You do deserve better

Dec

[Owlunar]

Hi @0402cliffe

I am sorry no one has replied - this is my thread and I haven't been here for a couple of days

To get a response you need to tag someone as I have above - you hit shift 2 which gives you a list of names and you can click on one of them or add your own tag - say for me it's @Dec - which doesn't work when I am writing the message - but you can see how your name has come up for you on my post

There's nothing your can do about your mother - and you are entitled to your resentments - in time you can learned to change yourself and your thoughts - but in the meantime

I kept away from my mother - it was too bad for my health to visit or even ring up - so don't feel badly about not seeing her - and as for your Dad - I guess he has made his choice -

How do you feel about contacting your father and letting him know you care about him and why you are keeping away from your mother?

Your anger can be released - but you need some help - are you seeing a therapist of any kind - in Australia we are entitled to 10 medicare assisted appointment with a psychologist

Also  as you directed your message to @Former-Member I have tagged her here - and let's see if you get an answer - maybe one of the other moderators can help with suggestions

So this is not your fault and you don't deserve it at all

I hope you haven't given up on us @0402cliffe - you deserve better

Dec

[Owlunar]

Hi @Former-Member

This is the "Mother Thread" - not much has happened here yet - I can have a bad day and a day to recover and lose the plot with the story line

My parents have died now - it was easy to let dad go - he was a man of faith and had a very successful life and he had his affairs in order and when the time go - he was prepared

But my mother - no - she lived for some years after him and totally lost it - dropped her bundle and took it out on everyone but me - and she couldn't get to me because I kept away

When we are children we do have to obey our parents - but when we reach adulthood then things change - and even though it hurt me so deeply and I missed my father so much through the years - I refused to let my mother verbally abuse me - I demanded her respect - and would not tolerate anything less

No - I never told her this - I would get up and walk out - and it would be years before I would see them - my family - until dad had enough and I was asked to return and until dad died he kept things under control

I haven't read your story yet - you may have already written it - but here you only need say what you feel the need to say or want to say

But believe me - you are not alone

Dec